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Hazel: And welcome to the scary goals club. I am your host, Hazel Robertson. And I believe that to make the impact that you know, you're called to make in the world, it requires setting bigger, scarier goals, and then becoming the person who creates them. That is what I am here to show you how to do. That's what we're diving into.
Mindset tools, tricks, really simple, practical, actionable steps. You can take and start applying straight away. Cause. Or whatever you believe, we have this one life that we definitely know about. Start making the impact you know you want to make in the world. Fear is not a reason to stop. We keep going. We work through the fear.
That is what we do in the Scary Goals Club. So come on in, come join, hit subscribe, and let's get started.
Hazel: Hi and welcome to the scary goals club podcast. I am here with Keith McRae from breakout recruitment.
Who's also one of the hosts of the beyond the craft [00:01:00] podcast. And, and I don't know if you know this Keith, You were my first paying client. Did you know that? Oh, really? Yeah, first. Huh. So I'd been coaching like pro bono before that and you were my first ever paying client.
So now you're my first ever podcast guest.
Keith: We keep that tradition going. I was actually looking through my notes today as well. And I think it was, you know, our third session was almost three years to the date.
Hazel: Yeah.
Keith: It's crazy actually, because I've really been going back in time now, looking at all the notes and everything that we've gone through, but you know, you didn't give the impression that I was your first paying client, if that's any contribution.
Hazel: so Keith was my first client, my first paying client, which he now knows is the founder of breakout recruitment and also lives in the Netherlands, but randomly, which we didn't even realize until I think maybe a few sessions in.
You're also from Stonehaven, which is where. I grew up and we went to the same high school. We're just [00:02:00] super
Keith: small world, isn't it? And then you went, you were in the same year as, one of my best mate's brothers.
But yeah, no, it's crazy how things work out.
Hazel: So over to you, if you want to give a bit of introduction, build on any of those things, or anything that you think might be useful before we dive into it.
Keith: Sure, sure. So well, as you said, I am the founder of Breakout International Recruitment. I support, collaborate, assist finance professionals and international clients on their finance and accounting positions, tending towards the executive search.
Aside from that, a husband - I've got two daughters, five and a half, she'll tell me, and 18 months old. So as a 43 year old, it, you know, you need a bit of energy to sustain those two little girls. But absolutely loving it.
We've got Beyond the Craft as well, which is about five episodes in and, we've already booked in, well, you're going to be a guest as well, actually, Hazel, but we've got [00:03:00] four guests already booked for the end of summer. So things are, things are heating up a little bit on that aspect too, there's a lot to come and I'm really quite excited.
First, summer holiday in a couple of weeks.
Hazel: Oh, so good.
Okay. going back to like making the decision to set up a business, if you could remember back, like, what were you thinking or believing that was helping you?
Like, I guess it's for any listeners that are They know they want to set up their own business but there's fear there and it feels quite scary.
Like what helped you actually be like, okay, I'm going on
Keith: When I worked for larger agencies, they were really very good training schools for recruitment consultants, but you know, a lot of good people were lost only from the basis that they weren't perhaps hitting numbers in a set period of time.
And, you know, I understand Recruitment, if you're a consultant and you're not billing, you're not earning money, then what's kind of your, your value to the business [00:04:00] and that how, that's how they perceive that you were, you had to be bringing a certain amount.
And I just, you know, I, I survived in that, but I didn't thrive in it.
And it wasn't until a few years down the line where I was working for another large agency that they, they kind of split the approach to recruitment. So you were either with a client or you were with the candidates and I really missed that three 60 part of it.
And I think that was the third, the third agency that I worked with as a recruiter. And what I was beginning to see was that they were all the same. I could go to a different one. But you know, it's, it's going to be exactly it's going to be a carbon copy, just a different logo,
So I thought to myself, I honestly had a belief at that point that I could do it better. That's maybe a bit, it's maybe a little bit arrogant. It's maybe a little bit arrogant. Or maybe not, you know, better. And, and I could do it my way, you know, because I obviously had a track record. Nobody had fired me for my jobs in recruitment.
So I'd obviously been performing to a certain [00:05:00] level. And, you know, and I had a good rapport with clients and candidates. as well. So I sort of had that little bit of self belief, it was a big step, you know, when you hand in your resignation, you, you, you serve your notice and then there's nothing normally you would transition into a new job.
And then I was kind of sat at home and then the computer's on the kitchen table and it's like, okay, And there's a list of
Hazel: people you cannot reach out to because you're not not allowed. It's like, where do you start? So for actually, I
Keith: think, so I think that was around October, November, I can't remember the year, but it wasn't until I think it was January or February when we actually got our first project online.
So there was a good two or three months there where nothing was happening. And I think it was getting to the point that something had to happen.
But yeah, thinking back, it was, it was quite a tense, scary moment, but you've got to have that little bit of self belief. I think if you don't have the belief at all, then I wouldn't, I wouldn't even consider starting it. [00:06:00] you need to have that trust in yourself.
And I think I had that, a little bit of trust and a little bit of arrogance.
Hazel: So good, I don't know if it's arrogance or like belief. And I love what you said, which is like, I could do it better and also doing it your way. And I think that's so powerful. Like when there are purposeful people like yourself looking around and being like, there's actually a better way that we could do this.
That's more aligned with your way, more aligned with your values, which is the building relationships, not having all these like KPIs and being a number. And I think the other thing it that sprung to mind is it it's almost like a lot of these moments of change, there's the discomfort of where you are. Gets bigger than the discomfort of where you might be going.
So oftentimes it's like when things are quite comfortable, it's easy to stay like it feels safe for our brain to be like, okay, cool, I'll just keep like going along. And then when it gets really uncomfortable, it can be like, oh, but it's familiar. And then it gets to tipping point where it's like, [00:07:00] okay, I know that I can do this better.
Wherever I'm going is not going to be as bad as this is right now. It's almost like it tips the other way. And that, that can often be like the
Keith: catalyst,
Oh, definitely. And I think that's what happened with me. I think that, that, that was the no comeback situation
Hazel: that
Keith: I found myself in. But now in, you know, having the perspective of starting another business and now, you know, just briefly on the podcast, it's given me that confidence, right.
To go out and try something new. And just, just to try it, you know, just to put things in place and, you know, and not being so caught up in will this work, will it not work? What happens if it doesn't? And, you know, that kind of negative spiral. But of course that, that all came from, you know, your coaching.
As well. I mean, we worked quite a lot on that, that kind of, you know, the circumstance thought feeling action and the kind of the result. And so that gave me a lot of trust and how I want to show up as well. So yeah.
Hazel: And it's the same thing with, yeah, as [00:08:00] you'd said, like the more times that we do things that feel scary, that we bet on ourselves, the easier it is to then do more of them. Even in other aspects of life, like podcasting is separate than business, but having gone through that with the business, you're able to take that same like confidence in yourself that you can figure it out into other aspects as well.
Keith: No, you're right. You're right. But as you say, that confidence doesn't come unless you're doing
I obviously had to be involved in the coaching session as well, and kind of open to receiving the information and, you know, assimilating it and putting it out there.
But
I think you have to have the connection with the individual. As well. I think if you don't have that connection, then you're not going to believe what they're telling you.
Hazel: So,
Keith: I think the, the, the way you brought it across as well and brought it down or, or, you know, broke it apart, that that's what kind of helped me is that, you know, it was these bite sized Pieces and we kind of honed in on small things that were happening [00:09:00] instead of looking at the, the massive actions, you know, it was really looking at the little ones.
What, what can you do now? And, and kind of break that down. And yeah, that, that helped a lot. And that's something that I've applied, I think over the last three years. And now I try to apply it to other people as well. So inadvertently I'm becoming a coach to the the professionals that I'm working with.
Also, but it's yeah, that, that belief is. It's quite, quite something. Once you have it and you've done those difficult things. You're right. It becomes a, it becomes a little bit easier. It'll never be completely easy because everything will be new depending on your situation. But the, you know, we, we, we spoke about becoming vegan.
I mean, I'm not vegan anymore, but I was, I was for at least six months, but you know, we, we spoke about that. I think there was the, the ultra races.
Hazel: Wait, let's just go back into the going vegan piece because that was, I guess your first. Scary goal that we kind of worked on together, or we'd [00:10:00] done like gone through goals and it was like, okay, which one are we diving into first?
And like from the outside, someone thinking about going vegan might be like, why isn't that scary? Like what's, what is going on? Why,
Keith: why was it scary?
Hazel: Why does it feel scary? And yet I don't know if you can remember if not, I can talk to some of that you do. And it's such an interesting example for so many different things in our life as well.
So talk to me, talk me through that. So there was the, you wanted to go vegan.
Keith: Yeah.
Hazel: What was holding you back? Why was it? What was
Keith: holding me back? In all honesty, it was the outside perspective of me going vegan, you know, like you have the, your family, your friends, and it was always always like a taboo subject.
It's like, you know, yeah, I'm going to try it. I'm going to go vegan. It's like, you know, they'd kind of look at you funny like you had leprosy or something. It's like, are you okay? Do we need to take you to a psychologist? Things like that. So you kind of keep that. [00:11:00] internalized, right? You don't speak about it because you're not speaking about it.
You're not really putting anything into action. There's no momentum there. So I was kind of tiptoeing my way, you know, adding some things into the diet and out of the diet and never really getting fully involved. I was reading enough books on it. You know, I think I read Rich Roll of course, who was a vegan.
I think there was this vegan podcast of these two ultra runners I was listening to. So I was doing all the research, you know, so, but I never actually took that That, that big step and sort of cleared everything out. I think I was, I'm yeah, long story short, I was too worried about what other people were thinking.
Hazel: Yeah. And I think you bring up so many amazing points there, which is oftentimes we can use reading and like finding out more information. I'll just do another course and I read another book and listen to another podcast as a way of avoiding what's really underneath, which is fear of what others will think.
And it can almost be like an escape and it's almost like the difference between you can read up about [00:12:00] lifting weights. But until you go into a gym and actually lift weights, like if nothing will actually change, you could know everything about the perfect technique for a squat. And until you actually do like one with weights, you're not going to actually, and there was something you said earlier, which I just want to pull it again, which was confidence comes from the doing is so good.
Like oftentimes we think, Oh, I need to feel confident before I can do something. It's like, you actually don't. You just need to have the courage to do. one thing, the first step and the confidence comes from when you've got the reps in and from doing. So good.
Keith: No, exactly. Right. And I think that's that, that vegan thing was, you know, I, I'd done all the small steps and I think, I think, I think in one session, it was kind of a push came push come to shove kind of situation.
It's like, okay, now it's happening and it's making the
Hazel: decisions, what's
Keith: the daTe?.
Hazel: Once
Keith: you made the decision and then it was the communication aspect as well, right. That we spoke about, it was so important then to actually involve. I only really had to involve my wife. I [00:13:00] mean, but it was informing her as to why I was taking this decision and, and, and making her understand a little bit.
And it took her a little while, I'll be honest, but eventually she also, she also kind of came round to it and, and you know, accommodated me in that sense as well, but it's that, that communication. So getting out there and actually speaking about it. You know, once you put it out there into the ether, it's like, okay, now we've got to take some action on it instead of keeping it just kind of locked up and procrastinating on.
Hazel: And I think like the other thing that's so interesting is again, these fears come again from our survival brain of being separate, like back in our caveman days and cave woman days, cave person days, there we go. Being separate from the tribe. Literally could have meant we would have died. We had to fend for ourselves, find our shelter, anything that separates us from our tribe feels really, really scary.
Like if everyone around you was a vegan, we wouldn't be having [00:14:00] this conversation. It wouldn't have been this scary thing, but it was something that you wanted that was potentially going to separate you from everyone around you that was closest to you, which feels like, like a life or death threat to our brain.
Keith: Oh, it did. Yeah. I mean, it wasn't, of course it wasn't, but it's, it's, yeah, it's right. Primitive state of mind at that point. Yeah. And I think I think that's a lot for a lot of the goals. I've also had as well that, that kind of survival, you know, being separated, you know, even the, the harebrained schemes, ideas that you have, you're scared to put them out there in case what people think and if people kind of leave you to the side or whatever, but over time you, you get over that.
Hazel: And even just thinking back, like what different ways of thinking or like what actually helped you do the goal? What was it that helped shift that from stopping from procrastination to actually doing it?
Keith: I think we'd just spoken about it, or I'd spoken about [00:15:00] it enough, actually. And it was at the point where it was just coming back around. again and again. And also it was the communication. So it was the putting it out there. Once it was done, it was communicated. You kind of drew the line in the sand and you said, okay, no, this is, this is going to happen.
Didn't set a date, you know, I'll do it next week, two weeks down the line. It was like, okay. Spoke to the, to the wife about it, this was going to happen. And that's, you know, That's when it happens. And then trying to keep the habit, of course,
Hazel: and what, like, even thinking back like, from where you are now, and having gone through that process, What advice would you have to like the Keith who was terrified?
Maybe that's an exaggeration, terrified, but you know, felt really uncomfortable having this lifestyle change that was completely different from everyone around.
Keith: I think again, maybe, maybe people will understand this as well as [00:16:00] that, you know, people are not thinking about you as much as you think they are.
And I think that was always in the back, Oh, what are they going to think? What's he going to think? And. That's just not the case. I mean, sometimes you're so absorbed on what are other people thinking, but they're actually more worried about their life, their situation, what they're going through. Of course, you're going to pop up now and again, you might be a little talking point at the dinner table or something like this.
the thing is, well, once you'd actually done it, and it was like a month or two in, It was like, that was it, you know, it was like, nobody was even mentioning anything about it. There would be a, maybe a couple of jokes here and there, but you know, it's like everything else with time, it moves on if people are interested in other things.
So it was like, what was all the fuss about?
Hazel: And even like all of that stuff that you just mentioned there. Like, that can be taken to, again, any other scary goal that's like, Oh, again, where there's the element [00:17:00] of the, what will others think others might judge it's like, literally they also might not, or they might, and then it will be just like Peter off and like, okay, this is just how things are now.
Yep.
Keith: Yeah. I think that's exactly it. I mean, you just look at world politics and what's going on geopolitically, it's the same. Unfortunately.
Hazel: So, good. That is so good. And following on from this, like, first goal that we set together, you also had a fail. You want to talk? Do you want to talk about that? That was going to have to
Keith: remind me of that fail.
Hazel: That was the you'd entered this mega ultra marathon in the
Keith: mountains.
Hazel: And I mean,
Keith: I was it a fail?.
Hazel: I know. Well, I think that's it. I actually used the word fail and I should have put it in quotes because there's so many times I think the language of some of the words that we use like fail, it makes us think like we've done something wrong.
We're a failure. And it's like, actually you [00:18:00] had a result you wanted and you didn't achieve the end result. Okay. Yeah. We do that every single day in so many different ways. Like
Keith: I know that's true, but that I fail. Yeah.
Hazel: Let's not say fail. What about it's a learning curve. That's what it was. A learning curve.
That was a big learning curve.
Keith: A steep
Hazel: mountainous learning
Keith: curve. Can't get all the puns in there. Yeah. That was horrific. That was actually horrific. I think.
Hazel: Well, talk us through. What was this? What happened?
Keith: So what is this? I think it was, it's called the Swiss Alps. The Swiss Alps. 100. I think previously I'd done like Can
Hazel: I just pause for, I don't know, for, to just jump in here.
Keith lives in the Netherlands. I don't know if I could, I can't remember if I said that. Yeah, I think, I think
Keith: we did at the start. Yeah. But let's, let's reiterate that. I live in the flattest country in the world. You know, we're below sea level, even where I am. I think maybe I'm on a little hill. But yeah, so this was the Swiss 100.
It was a quite a small race. So 100 kilometers. I think they also had like a 30 and 50 or whatever, but the 100 [00:19:00] one was the And I had, of course, I'd ran some marathons. I wasn't great at them, to be honest, you know, I did Amsterdam and New York but that, that was to get me back into kind of shape as it were.
And then I found trail running. So then I found the UTMB, of course, OCC. So I'd hit all these goals, right. I managed to get fit for a marathon, managed to get fit for another one. I applied for the OCC and in order to get the, the lottery points, you need to do like three or four races. under a certain time you got the points to get enough for a ticket.
So I did all these 50k's, 55k's, and I think I also did a 65k in Spain the year before the Swiss 100. So I thought, okay, you know what, I could get this ultra running Lark, you know, the Spain when we're starting at sea level and just went up and up and up and up but wow, the Swiss Alps, I think we turned up two days before the race.
So obviously being a bit of a newbie, I didn't really [00:20:00] think about elevation or I would, that was even going to impact me. So I go I think it was about 30 kilometers. Or a little less into the race. But there was a point where I was at the top of this peak and it's like, I'd never experienced anything like it in my life.
I don't know what you call altitude sickness or something like this. Right. It's like the world was spinning and it couldn't have happened at the most. Annoying point because I'm a little afraid of heights as well. And of course this race has a great big bloody suspension bridge across, you know, across a massive canyon canyon and so i'm suffering from this altitude and i've got luckily i've got this english guy with me Who's kind of like, you know pulling me along and oh man, I was I was in pieces I was really a bit, I was like stopping every kilometre, catching my breath and disorientated.
I didn't know what was going on. So eventually I got to the checkpoint and I'd actually made the [00:21:00] cutoff. Quite surprisingly, the woman at the checkpoint was very nice. She says, you know, you could go on if you wanted to, do you want to? And she was just telling me about how people were really suffering on the next part.
And so I took the decision actually to, to pull myself from the race at that point. I think maybe if it was a year or two. Earlier, I may have been a bit RC about it and just tried to, you know, fight on with it and see where, where I would have got, but I took it is that I'd actually enjoyed apart from the elevation sickness, of course, or the altitude sickness quite enjoyed the race.
And then I realized at that point, I would never be doing 100 kilometer races. again, in the Alps or anything with elevation. And thankfully from, from pulling out, from being quite mature with the decision, it turned out to be a good choice because I think, I think later that day or the day after we'd heard how someone had to be airlifted.
From one [00:22:00] of the peaks on the back end of the course, because she had then suffered from the, the altitude sickness. She'd gone a bit haywire to the point where a couple of guys had to pin her down because she was just completely disorientated. And then they had to airlift her off of the the peak and the English guy I saw the day after it looked like he had shell shock.
I mean, he was a walking zombie. So I was happy, you know, I pulled out, I think it was just over the 35 K mark, you know, close to marathon. Happy with that. You know, beautiful day, got a bit of a suntan, had an ice cream, and but that was, that was, yeah, okay, it was a fail in the respect that that was my first ever DNF.
So I had to take that on the chin, but I was happy with that, that decision. And since then, my focus has been on like 25, 27k races, you know, done and dusted in a few hours. You say done and
Hazel: dusted. It's still like quite a few hours of running in the mountains. It
Keith: is. It is. You forget about that. Right. I mean, what is it?
The. The. The. Skyline, [00:23:00] Scotland Skyline, Glencoe Skyline, I've done it twice now, the
Hazel: Ring of Steall,
Keith: the Ring of Steall. Yeah. Yeah. You know, these races as well. I mean, it's pretty epic.
Hazel: It was like
Keith: nine hours of epic
Hazel: and the sheer drop, like on either side of some of the ridges as well. Like, well, we
Keith: were lucky the first time we did it, we couldn't, we couldn't see like more than a meter and a half in front of us.
So you didn't actually realize what was on the side, but you could hear it. That was another race where a helicopter tried to airlift somebody who had fallen and broken their leg. But couldn't land because of the weather. I mean, it was just, that was Lord of the Rings stuff, but
Yeah, but no, I think that the races in particular, I think the, the Swiss one, you know, we talk about doing the hard things. It certainly prepares you kind of mentally. even for your business, right? I think to myself now, okay, if I can get myself through like, you know, 12 hours of ultra running, I can get myself through this next hour, And it's also the same from the Swiss one, you know, when enough is enough now. You know, you know, now I know myself when, [00:24:00] okay, now is the time to pull back, take stock and maybe change direction as to which I did. But that was I say, you've got to do it first to, to understand where your limitations are.
And I found that. Yeah. Great experiences, actually. Yeah.
Hazel: And I think that's so powerful as well. It's almost like, again, whether it's. These endurance races or your business or any, any scary goal you're doing is like also understanding why you're doing it. Yeah. And I guess that helps with the decision that you made in the Swiss race.
Like, you're not doing it to like break yourself and be airlifted and like crawl to the finish line. I don't think. It didn't sound like it. No, it wasn't that. To understand like more about yourself. I think I also remember you saying during that race, it was really hot, like really, really hot. And then when you add heat in as well, I mean, it's just so easy for like, for bodies to shut down.
So yeah. Definitely.
Keith: It was, it was, but it was good, you know, we went away with the family for like a long weekend. The nephews were there, brother in law, sister in law, you know, father in law. So it was you know, [00:25:00] kids had a good time at the open air swimming pool that day. So that's, you know, good memory for them.
Hazel: I think it, again, it's like with all of these things. You have an idea of what you want, like you have a plan, like you wanted to run the race and you showed up and you'd done your training and then things will happen that you maybe don't account for that, like the heat and like knowing how you might be altitude and all of these things.
And it's ultimately then how you respond to that. It's the same in business and being able to, like you did in that moment. weigh it up, be like, okay, what is it I'm actually here for not to punish myself around to the next checkpoint, but actually like, okay, maybe this is complete. This race is complete and actually make that decision.
And knowing that, and then. Just owning that decision. And so actually, yeah, even again, it comes to like the language we use to describe things like that just sounds like a success. And it's so easy to be like, if something didn't happen, it is a fail. And it's like, what if actually [00:26:00] pushing on and being airlifted, truly that's more of a fail than make a decision to take care of your health.
I
Keith: think that would have been, but maybe that's just the way we're programmed, right? I think maybe You know, as a young kid, you either you're successful at something or you're not, you, you pass an exam, you fail an exam, sometimes, you know, and maybe that's just what we carry through with us. We're not really taught to kind of learn.
from our mistakes or, you know, take retrospective action and things like that. You don't learn that too much later in life, but yeah, nothing is ever really, it should never be labeled as a fail, I think. And it's like the, the, the saying that I use now that also came from, from your mouth, Hazel was, you know, we, we all, we always say, What's the worst that can happen, right?
And then you'd be, so now it's the same. And I used this actually recently, I think we were doing the podcast or when we were starting the podcast, I said to the, cause it's like, what's the best that can happen. And automatically it just reframed your mind as well. So it's, [00:27:00] you know, stop using these negative connotations.
Hazel: I'm so there with you. And I think it's what's the other phrase? It's like, you're either winning or you're learning. So it's not a fail. It's like, okay, you didn't get some outcome you wanted that maybe didn't take something into account or there were things that happened. Okay. Well, what can you learn from that?
And I think, yeah, that language, like the way that we talk about our situation matters, because if we're telling ourselves we're failing and beating ourselves up, we're less likely to go and try. If it's like, okay, cool. I learned something. So much from that. Now, what am I doing next? We're like,
Keith: that's so true.
And that's, that's a real sort of mindset thing that everybody should be working on. I mean, I find myself in that situation in the last couple of weeks where you get into this kind of negative loop, you know, I think I've been working so hard for the last couple of years and I'm actually a little bit quiet at the moment, but I think that's also fine, but I wasn't fine with it a week ago, you know, and it's not, it's only from kind of stepping back and then thinking about, okay, you know, now I have this time to focus on the different things that I've.
I've been [00:28:00] involved with the last few months and I can tie up some loose ends and, but as soon as you put the negative spin on it, it's like, you just go down and down and down and down. And it wasn't until I think the beginning of this week where I think reading through old notes and obviously some books and podcasts that I listened to as well, you're just like, no, okay.
There's a reason we have time now. So actually make good use of it. But that's also something you really have to work on, I think, and people could do with a lot of help with.
Hazel: I think also we're fed again from, you know, it's like a society, it's like more, more, more growth, growth, growth, push, push, push.
And it's like, when we actually, I'm doing a lot of reading on like, At the moment, nature and like bringing nature into your business and aligning with that. And it's like, when you think about nature, it's very cyclical. It's like in winter, things close down and like kind of hibernate week as humans feel a bit more sleepy.
There's other seasons that feel a bit more like energizing, maybe like summer, but they can also come at different points in our business. Like, sometimes summer people are in holiday and so business is in [00:29:00] a wintering period. And it's like just knowing that there are natural ebbs and flows helps to be like, okay, what is it I need in this phase in this season right now?
And like giving yourself that rather than like, it should be at this, you know, high level of output and productivity all the time. It's like, we're not robots, we're not machines, but it's so easy to think we quote unquote should be because that's what we're getting sold. Like more and more and more push, push, push.
Keith: Exactly. Yeah.
Hazel: It's
Keith: like
Hazel: life's a bit more fluid.
Okay. So now I want to change tack just slightly. And again, this is something that we worked through together and I know that this is something I coach a lot of clients on and I know that listenersWe'll find it really helpful and that is getting over the fear of showing up online of when you are a business owner or, you know, a leader in your business and putting your opinions out there publicly, putting your face maybe out there, whether it's on LinkedIn or it's on Instagram or your social [00:30:00] media.
what stopped you from kind of showing up and then how did you navigate through that? And I say this like personally, I've not posted on LinkedIn in like, well, I think I put one post up last week in like a few months. And I know that. And this is like a very honest thing.
It's almost like Instagram posting that feels okay. Podcasting that feels okay for some reason. And I know what it is. It's just like, there's a fear right now for me of being seen on LinkedIn. It's like, I think just, sorry, this is a tangent. I know this podcast isn't about me, right? I just want to preface it by honest, how I am right now.
A lot of it is. So last year I was diagnosed with ADHD and in some ways Instagram and this podcast feels like a really safe place to voice that and to talk about that. So I feel like those two places I can be authentically me, LinkedIn, there's still in the back of my mind whenever I go to post, I'm imagining having to be quote unquote professional.
And I know that that then blocks me from being [00:31:00] authentic and sharing. Me personally, whereas I don't feel that with Instagram and I don't feel that here. So I know that's my blocker and it's something I'm working through at the moment. And also there's an inertia when you don't really post to having to get back on and doing it.
It's true. The first thing is always like, Oh, so I just want to say. I am there. I have been there. I'm still there. I go through it in waves and that's where I am at the moment. And so, yeah, it's not just people I coach, it's me too, even though I do show up in lots of different places.
Keith: I can understand what you're saying though, with the podcast and Instagram, because I think there's some sort of blurred lines now with LinkedIn as well.
I think a lot of people are saying, Oh, it's not Facebook. Oh, it's not Instagram. It's, you know, I, I actually spoke with a professional last week and we're, You know, I also advise a little bit or consult on their, their resumes and, and also how they appear online. And we talk about their LinkedIn profile and he was like, [00:32:00] Oh no, but LinkedIn, you know, that's just where people go, Oh, I'm so proud.
Oh, I'm so happy. Oh, I'm overwhelmed with joy. You know, it's like, okay, okay. I see where you're coming from on that one, but
you know, so that there is that. That sort of feeling from a lot of people that, you know, it isn't, I don't know, even useful perhaps, but for me, I had the same thoughts as I had when we were talking about going vegan, it was, Whoa, you know, I put something out there, it's out there.
And what are people going to say? How are they going to react? You know, how are they going to perceive me? I mean, there's so many things to consider. And it took a while to get over that and I took it step by step. So I did start, I think I. It helped. I signed up for like a specific course as well, you know, so we'd spoken about it and I thought, right, okay, let's, let's seek out some professionals who deal with recruiters and helping them create content.
And then, you know, they, they gave this kind of framework as to how you can work, you know, how you [00:33:00] can do this kind of what do they call it? Personal content, professional content, interesting content, and you create your messages and stories through that. And it made it a little easier to break it, to break it down and think of your audience.
Because there's, I mean, I don't know how many connections you have, but I've got close to like 13, 000. And they're never all going to see my posts because of the way that algorithms work on LinkedIn as well. You know, even your first few posts won't be seen by anybody unless you're interacting with people on the platform.
So, you know, you think way too much. You think that when you put it out there, that it's like everybody in your network is going to get an email ping. Ah, look, you know, Hazel's just updated her site and everybody's going to go check it. It's not, it's not quite like that. So I think we have to, to get over that.
And it's only, it's only visible for a few hours. As well, and that's one thing I didn't realize that was holding me back because again, you think you put it out there, it's like there forever and people are going to see it whenever they want to see it. And I mean, do you remember the posts that you read yesterday on LinkedIn or even this morning?[00:34:00]
Hazel: I've not even really been on LinkedIn. I know, but
Keith: that's how it is. I mean, you see so many, it's like, it's like when you go, you're scrolling through Instagram or the stories. I mean, some will, some will hit and sort of leave a little mark, but the rest are kind of like, Oh, you see it. And then you. move on.
And I think that's the mindset I had to get over that. And so I had this, this course, which helped. And then eventually, you know, I took on Hawkshoe Academy, and they helped sort of copyright content as well. So it was coming from my mouth, but it just had someone professional putting it together.
And now I work with a personal branding coach Nicole, and she's kind of taken it to a new level. So now I see LinkedIn really as a tool for beyond the craft, really as a tool for me and for breakout. And what you were saying there about authenticity, I think people are more appreciative. of that on LinkedIn now,
So the more authentic you are, and, you [00:35:00] know, so long as you have that message, and I think that's the important thing that, you know, there had to be something there, there had to be a message for your audience, whether it was for me, for the client side, for the candidate side, something that they could take away, not just a, I don't know, a selfie with me and my dog or me and my cat, or, you know, something like that, but there had to be some sort of message.
Don't get me wrong, profile pictures still do well on LinkedIn, if you have a selfie and things like that. But it has to resonate. And this is what I talk a lot about with senior finance professionals as well. You have to get beyond that and think of it really as your billboard. I think especially if you try to build a business or even as an ambitious finance professional, I mean, Nicole's kind of opened my eyes to this is that, you know, you can have these reels and you can pin documents.
So if you've got something you're for instance, you know, you're into ECG and, you know, carbon neutral, things like that. You could write a good post on that and [00:36:00] you could pin it to your profile so people can come in and they see more about you. You know, what, what are you involved with? You know, does this person, do I have an affinity with them?
So it's, it's really think about how you can use it to your benefit. You don't think about everybody else, you
Hazel: know,
Keith: think about how, how you can use your benefit, how you can educate, how you can get your message out there that could potentially help others as well. And I think once you have that in mind, it's, it's much easier and you're, you're far more at ease when the posts go out.
Yeah. You'll get a couple of comments from People now and again, you know, it's always going to happen, but there's so few. It's, it's incredible. And the posts are all quite, yeah, very positive, you know people will like it, they might engage me, they might not, but it's, it's, It's, it's that habit loop, right?
And then you've got to be consistent with it. And like you said, now you, you've kind of dropped out, right? So it's, I know it's harder to get started. And now you're probably thinking, Oh, what am I going to write about is, yeah, but it is, it's, [00:37:00] it is a little bit like that, you know? But I, I would suggest then if, if, if people are really struggling with it, is to maybe seek out a copywriter, you know, somebody who is kind of a professional in the LinkedIn, in the personal branding.
Of course, I'd recommend Nicole for this one, but there are people out there who can help you. With that, you know, and you, you can use that almost as like a, as a shield, if you want, you know, you're talking about it, someone else's copywrite for it. And then they put it out there for you. But yeah, more and more in business as well.
I think people aren't so much interested in the brands as, as to oppose who the people are. Within the brands, you know, so it's all about you. So just, just, yeah, you just got to do it.
Hazel: Yeah, I know. That's it. Like after this, I say that now.
I don't know if there's any similar things that you find that help you then with podcasting. So with podcasting, like for me, [00:38:00] the thing that's really helped is talking about stuff that I find genuinely really interesting. I'm like, if I find this interesting, someone else is going to find it interesting as well and like bringing in stuff that is useful to other people, but I'm like,
I love scary goals. I love the mindset and like that growth, all of that. And that's really helped me. And I guess it's just then taking that to LinkedIn and being like, just trusting that if I'm really interested in it, and I think it's like really exciting, someone else is probably going to like, it's almost going back to the coaching and the model, one of the tools that we use, which is how you are being like the actions you're taking, how you're showing up is driven by how you're thinking and feeling.
You could do the same actions of like write a post. Yeah. If you're thinking this is boring, you're probably gonna write a boring post. You're just gonna be a bit like uh, like the, the writing's gonna be very different if you're like, I cannot wait to share this. This is so interesting. This is so cool.
It's gonna be very different in what you're actually sharing. So it's knowing [00:39:00] that, again, it comes back to that belief about what you're doing. And the more that, as you said, it's like you can almost drown out. Everyone else and be like, no, this is really important or this is valuable or this is useful.
Keith: Definitely. And I think it's, you gotta, like you said earlier, you gotta, you know, couple that with how you want to be present, how, how you want to show up. You know but yeah, it is a, it's a super interesting topic, isn't it?
I've found that since I've been posting kind of consistently, there's, there's people coming from my network and outside my network seeking my assistance now, you know, they're not engaging with the posts.
but they're sending DMS. So it's opening up a whole different kind of network for me as well. And a whole different kind of line of opportunity. So, you know, you, you could get that one win from this. that can be a catalyst for, for other things, but you're just, you know, you're too inhibited because you're, you're worried about what other people are going to say and whether your message is useful or not, but someone will [00:40:00] find it useful.
They will find it engaging.
Hazel: And it's like, if you believe it is, then yes, at least, yeah, that's exactly
Keith: it.
And I think. the more valuable information that you're posting on LinkedIn,you're obviously building up your online sort of persona.
You, you, you've got to build up that trust. People have got to read it and they're, they're, they're going to say, okay, you know what, they actually have something to say and they can, they can help me. But you'll never get to that point if you're not posting anything.
Hazel: I know, I know, I know it. Okay.
Keith: But it's, I mean, yeah, but you're right in what you said earlier, you know, if you're thinking about the message and you, you're excited about the message or it really, it's something close to your heart, then of course it's going to be far more impactful.
So, you know, start there.
Hazel: Okay. I'm doing it. I'm doing it. You got me. And I like
Keith: it, Hazel. I'll give a little thumbs up.
Hazel: Thanks. You're always great at liking them. Thank you.
Okay. So just before, I've got a few [00:41:00] more
I, I want to talk a little bit about the balance of entrepreneurship, scary goals, all of that with having a family and how that has maybe shifted, how you navigate it and then any like things that you find really helpful.
Keith: Oh yeah. Getting out of my own head was the first one. Of course I started the business before Nina.
Was around and then well, you know yourself when they arrive It's like it's a whirlwind those those first six months are just I don't think you can even recall them You know, you kind of buried them. No, it's not. No, it's not as bad as that. But how do I balance that in the first year? Extremely difficult.
I'll be honest. I was fighting it hard. I was like, I still have to be doing my five days. Okay. But I still have to, you know, obviously help with Nina you know with Nina, it was also quite difficult because my wife, she had [00:42:00] uh, postpartum as well. So, you know, she was kind of the disassociation there with Nina.
So that was also quite tough. So we had a lot of different things going on. And it wasn't until, I don't know how it actually happened, but. I sort of gave myself to it at a certain point. But that only happened really a couple of years ago when Nina was about two or three. So it was a large work in progress.
I still find myself, you know, I had one day a week with Nina. I'd have, I'd have the whole day myself. They call it like a papadag or a father's day in the Netherlands. So I'd take her swimming and do these things, but I still find myself going to the phone, checking emails, you know, did I miss anything?
And it wasn't until I kind of stepped back and really, Looked at what I was doing, you know, Nina was sitting there having her, I don't know, a sandwich or whatever. We're at the side of the pool and I'm going through the phone and I'm thinking, I'm really not, I'm not here with her. And I was like, if I, you know, what is actually going to happen if I don't answer this email?
You know, really is my client going to run away and say, [00:43:00] why didn't you answer me within 30 minutes of me sending this? So it was getting out of my own head. In that regards and being really present with Nina helped as well. And that's something I miss now, because now we have our second daughter, Amy. But now that Annie, my wife, she exited her business last year.
So she's staying at home at the moment that I don't have these times with the kids, unfortunately, you know, like the full day. So I do kind of miss that actually having once I'd gotten into it, but. I think it's also important that, for me anyways, that I created the habits of getting up early. So what I found helped for me as well was if I was up before the kids, or up before Nina, so I started getting up at 5am.
So I knew then I would have two hours, I could work, I could read, I could go to the gym, whatever, and I'd accomplished something before she'd woken up. I found it was better for me to have [00:44:00] You know, be prepared for her waking up as opposed to her waking me up, and then I'm sort of more engaged as well.
So I think that's really helped in kind of finding a balance. Understanding that, yeah, if I don't get back to somebody straight away, that the world's going to end or my business is going to fail. So getting that out of my head. And you have to keep reminding yourself to sometimes be present with your kids.
I mean, I see it more now, you know, Nina's five and a half, Amy's 18 months, you know, Nina's learning to swim. There's so many things that she's doing now. It's crazy. It's going super fast. So sometimes I just find myself. sitting with Amy, even on the sofa, and just holding her while we maybe watch Mr.
Tumble or something like this. And just being fully present in that moment and allowing those moments as well and not thinking like, oh, she's sitting comfortably. I'm going to go up, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do that. I mean, but it was, Super [00:45:00] long learning curve for me in that aspect. I think what also helped was taking care of myself.
So continuing with the fitness. So having my own pursuits outside of the business and outside of a family as well. So it was the running, I don't know, the CrossFit, hyrox, things like this, you know, so for me keeping in shape and. Keeping the energy levels up also allows me to be present with the, with the girls as well, because I don't want to be the type where I'm out of breath or I don't have the energy to, to play with them and, and engage with them and things like this.
So it's, it's multifaceted, but it takes a while or it took me a while. Anyway, maybe some other people have got nice tips and tricks about it as well, but I think we all struggle. And it's, it's, I don't know, I think you've kind of said it, said it earlier as well as maybe we're worried about what. People will think maybe there's these [00:46:00] expectations that we have to be working, the kids have to go to daycare, you know, how so many people have a have a say, right, and how you should be raising your kids and things like this, you know, eventually got to say just screw them.
Actually, that's the other thing, right? I'm going to do it my way. This is how I want to spend my time with my kids. If I'm going to, and now I've got to the point, right? You know, I don't mind. You know, the girls are home at like, well, Amy's home at like five o'clock from kindergarten. Nina's home around 3.
15 from school. I'll always make sure if I hear her come in the door, I don't mind. I'm going to spend 20 minutes with her when she comes home. And I'm going to make sure, you know, I'm finished work at five because everything can be picked up again. Once they go to bed. Or tomorrow morning. And it's that understanding that's kind of really helped me finding that balance instead of just getting choked up and thinking the business is, that's it comes above everything else.
But as I said, it took a while, Hazel.
Hazel: Oh, I'm getting actually really [00:47:00] emotional. You speaking about that, like, again, we could probably do a whole podcast episode on this and yeah, thank you for sharing that. And sometimes I think you have to learn these lessons, almost the hard way of going so out with your own.
What's up your priorities of like, you know, your daughter's there, who's like, you're her, like one of our most important people in her life. And you're on your phone and it's like, wait, this client is literally not going to remember or not if I email right now. And just, you know, it can feel really hard sometimes to learn it that way.
I had a bit of that last year with Developing this program and spending time that I would have been with Flynn like a way and I was like, wait, this is like enough. And I think a hundred percent, I agree that like first year, but like after your kid arrives, it's almost like you're trying to fit this whole, like your world's turned upside down.
You're trying to fit it into how you used to do things rather than like, you think you
Keith: can, right?
Hazel: Yeah. Rather than like, okay, everything is different now. What is important now has changed. [00:48:00] How do I want my life to be and rebuilding that and letting go of, yeah, as you said, like the shoulds of how we should do things.
We're in that at the moment, we were lucky enough to be able to both work two days a week last year. Now it's three days a week and you know, so we have two days each where we have Flynn on our own. And so Luke sometimes goes to all these like play groups and different things and he's the only dad and there's that where it's, you're doing things so differently than other people around you.
And they could look at you weird, but it's like, but this is what's right for us at the moment. I think there's so much of that with being a parent where it's easy for everyone to have an opinion and you just have to listen to like, Oh yeah. Oh yeah.
Keith: you're right about that, that, that traditional thing about Luke turning up to the play group and being the only dad that, that was me going to swimming lessons as well.
Or maybe there was sometimes there was another, another dad as well. I mean, there's a whole topic of discussion around that. Right. my wife, she, as I said, she exited her business and she's kind of a stay at home mum now. And it took her a long time to adapt to that pace.
Hazel: Yeah.
Keith: With the girls [00:49:00] as well and slowing yourself down, because you say you have this expectation you should be working. Go, go, go. You should be out there earning money, hustling, doing all these different things. Don't get me wrong, she does want to go back to work but I think now I see a big difference in her and now that she's kind of.
Allowed it. And she's really enjoying her time with the girls now. And you see the bond and the connection is so different. So I think it's vitally important that we remind ourselves that the, you know, there's a real scarcity of time. It's very cliche as well. You know, it's like someone says, just, you know, you're going to be eight year old one time.
You're going to be looking back thinking shit, you know, that's yeah, should have spent more time doing this, that, or the, the other thing. So priorities indeed.
Hazel: Yeah. And even that, like that you were able to do there, like being able to imagine in the future. Like I did that a lot with Flynn and like, then think back and it's like, he's only going to be this age once.
Like I'm only going to have these moments once. Like that helps me be really present because oftentimes, and again, I think part of it's an ADHD [00:50:00] thing. I can be quite distracted sometimes with like, Oh, I have to do this thing. I have to do that. Rather than like. Yeah. Okay. You know, I can be with him, but thinking like, okay, cool.
I'll go and chop some veg or I'll go and do something else. And actually it's the moments that I can catch that, that I'm wandering to the kitchen for the like 13th time and he's bringing a book through and I'm like, okay, no, I just actually want to sit and we read or we like make do a silly game or do something silly or we're outside.
I'm like, I'm really present. Those are the moments at the end of the day that are like, that stick with me. I like I'm going back through my day and I'm like, Oh, it was so fun when we were like having this fun little moment. And so that helps me then remember to be more present, but I don't know what helps you.
Like how are you able to catch it in the moment? Cause I think presence, like you almost don't need time. You need presence because you could be with your kids and distracted, which you used to be.
Keith: Yeah. I think I'm far more aware of picking up the phone now. You know, it's just a, it's almost like a habit.
And we, we had a, we spoke about this [00:51:00] as well, right? This is a massive distraction. So I think my wife and I are, we're quite on top of that because Amy's picking things up very quickly. She sees us on her phone. So she's like, all right, I want the phone. So we try to put them out, out of sight. And. I think I, you know, it helps in the beginning where you said to yourself, okay, you know what I'm going to spend 20 minutes with them.
And you said, you can just set the time limit in your own mind. Okay. 20 minutes, I'm going to play with them. I'm going to do this. And you know, sometimes they're happy with that, but how did I, how did I let go? How did I be present? I think it, with Amy, it became more natural because you're right back at the beginning again.
And then I was thinking as well with Nina when she was so young, is that I was like, I was like, you, you, you would think because they're comfortable lying on their backs doing something. Oh, I, I, now I can Hoover. Now I can do the vegetables and I can do the washing. And then I was like, no, right. No, I'm going to sit with her.
If she wants to read a book, we're going to read a book. I'm going to follow her around the house. If she wants to jump on a [00:52:00] bike, climb up a chair, we give her a bit of free reign in that regard. So she's but she's also a very good communicator already at 18 months old. I mean, she'll, she'll actually grab you by the hand or take a book to you and pat the chair that you have to come and sit next to her as well.
So they
Hazel: know what
Keith: they want, but that helps. Yeah, it's like, it's just what you said there. You, you, you imagine a little bit. And now that we, we have Amy again, is that you see where Nina is, you see where Amy is, and You know, you see how quickly that time kind of flew by. So I have no hesitation now.
Sitting, as I said, sitting on the sofa, lying on the trampoline with them, letting them jumping around, you know, out there blowing bubbles, all that kind of stuff. And somewhere it's nice, you know, you engage that inner kid as well sometimes. So it's it's good fun. But then I think you just see the smile on their face.
Sometimes, you know, so but there are moments, of course, you do have to say, okay, it can't happen quite right now. So again, you've got that little bit of [00:53:00] balance, but you know, it is it is a nice thing.
Hazel: And okay. So I'm just checking the batteries in my mic. I think we're good. So before we wrap up, and what is, I know there's so many things that I like wanted to ask, but I'm going to, maybe we can do another one then.
Like what is. Next in terms of scary goals or what are you working on?
Keith: a few different things, actually scary goals. So the first, I suppose, beyond the craft, the podcast that, that was, that still is a bit of a scary goal. I mean, we've obviously got the episodes going and very fortunate Kev, he's involved, my cousin.
So he's engaged in it. We've got Jono, you know, he works for the BBC helping us produce. And we've got Marco doing the editing, so we have a good team around us, but that is one of the scary goals, because after the summer we're going to be interviewing. And at the moment, it's just me and Kev talking about things that interest us, about things that we think will interest other people, you know, that's fine.
But now that we have actually some serious [00:54:00] people lined up, it's like, okay.
Hazel: You know, I
Keith: think you're, you're putting yourself out there, right? I mean, we're obviously amateurs, but you don't want to come across that you haven't prepared. The reason that we want to do this is we want to create a community.
We want to inform other people in, you know, the industries that I'm involved with and Kev's involved with, the way that different people work, how they think,
But yeah, big learning curve, super scary. We don't know where it's going. And um, I suppose the other one is we've still got the ambition to, as a family to move abroad. So I think we're looking at, we've set a date January 2026.
We've started the conversations around that at the beginning of this year, and now it's beginning to take momentum. So we're going out to, I think it's, well, I don't think it is, we're going to Bali in the summer. You know, to speak with people out there who have made that type of move.
We stayed at an Airbnb last year of this couple [00:55:00] who are selling their place. So we're talking with them, what it was like to raise kids. So we're doing all the groundwork now, but we're, we're actually physically making the steps. It's still scary. I mean. Halfway across the world, we've got the usual thoughts, you know, friends leaving behind, family, what if something happens to her parents, and, you know, how will the girls settle, they've got their friends here, Nina especially, so you've, you've still got all that.
in your mind, but we seem to be getting over those hurdles. And that's by communicating with each other and guiding each other in going through the steps. And the other last scary goal, I said, well, there's two, I'm doing hyrox as an individual for the first time in October. Not looking forward to that one, but
Hazel: for, I guess for listeners, it's like a, more cardio version of like a CrossFit 'cause you've the running aspect and the strength, But that's, I dunno how you would explain it.
Keith: Yeah, it's brutal. I, I dunno, it's like a. It's like a hit session on speed or something like this. I mean, because it's like eight kilometers in total, right? And you think eight kilometers, peanuts, I can do eight kilometers. I'm asleep. But then [00:56:00] you add in one kilometer on a ski machine, which, you know, is brutal.
And then you have the sled push. It's like burpee broad jumps. I mean, that's a torture move. You know, so I, I did it with my brother in law as a partner as a doubles and we, we really enjoyed it. So we're all going to do the singles now. So training for that. And then the last one is, yeah, I'm working on a new business line at the moment as well.
So. I'm finding myself going and reverting back to some of the old thoughts, you know, what will people think about it? How do you price it? What are people going to say about this and that? But that'll be going live in a few weeks, actually. So that's going to be a consultation type business offering for people who are looking to move out of their jobs, but need some help with, I don't know, resumes, interview prep online profile, how they're being seen and things like this.
So doing a whole package around that at the moment, which is quite exciting. But again, I had a lot of those thoughts that come through my head, but then you just kind of, bam, slap them to the [00:57:00] side and you say, okay, what's the best that's going to happen, you know? So a few different things. I
Hazel: love that.
It's like, yeah, so easy. Our brain will always go to the worst and we spend so little time thinking about the best, unless we ask ourselves, okay, what actually is the best? And just imagining, and the more that we can imagine the best case, the more likely we are to then go and create it.
Keith: No, exactly.
Exactly. And I think you've got to surround yourself with, with good people as well. So where I am at the moment, you know, the wife support, if I've got Kev for the podcast, Nicole's helped your, your, your work in the past with me has been highly impactful as to where I am now as well. So, you know, seek out those people as well.
That's what I would say to individuals. Don't be afraid to engage with them because you'd be super surprised as to what can happen.
Hazel: Okay. Is there anything else we've not covered?is there anything that you want to share or that you think would be useful to listeners
Keith: I mean, if anybody needs to get in touch with me, for example, I don't know if there's anybody in your network or. Anybody in mind, they're having some thoughts about, you know, [00:58:00] LinkedIn, CVs, moving roles, whatever, then they can always get in touch with me on LinkedIn or through the website, send me a DM.
And I'll put all your
Hazel: details in the show notes as well. So that's perfect.
Keith: And then Yeah. I think if anybody's looking for assistance with kind of mindset and goals, I think they should get in touch with you, Hazel. I brag about you to everybody, really, it's set me on a path.
Hazel: That's very kind. Well, it's been, I mean, it's obviously been a complete honor and privilege to coach you and it's been an honor and a privilege to have you on the podcast, especially as my first guest and you've been so generous, not only with your time, but all of your wisdom and everything you've learned and.
it's been amazing just watching what you've created over the last few years. And I am like, I'm so excited for where you're going next, especially with Bali. I remember that was one of the things we kind of,
Keith: it was, wasn't it?
Hazel: Right. Two years
Keith: ago. Yeah.
Hazel: Oh, I wanna do this, but it's like I can't, and all the limiting beliefs and it's like, like you're doing it. I know. Like you went out to test it last year and now it's like you've made the decision and put a date on it. [00:59:00] Like so powerful. Just like creating the life that you want and Yeah.
Yeah. It's intention,
Keith: isn't it? Yeah, exactly. it's been great to be on Hazel and really fantastic to be your first guest.
Hazel: I know.
Keith: Thank you. Yeah. And I can't wait to have you on our podcast.
Hazel: I know. Okay, . Thanks. See ya.
Keith: Thanks Hazel. See you.
Hey, thanks so much for listening. If this was helpful, please hit subscribe and leave a review. This helps get this work in the hands of more purposeful people. That is more people creating bigger, scarier goals, making an even bigger impact in the world. And if you want to take this work deeper and work with me directly, head to the show note and I put all of the information there.
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